Welcome to Club SAITO !
03-09-2008, 03:28 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Thanks for all the suggestions. I will look for a better battery. I opened the hood on my truck and hooked up my starter. I then put it against my 180 and it seemed to turn it over just fine.
Thanks again
Mike
Thanks again
Mike
03-09-2008, 03:52 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Lighten up Mike. Opinions are what a discussion forum is all about. Like the TV---- if what we see upsets us too bad we could always turn it off.
03-09-2008, 04:09 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
There have been many posts since my little plea for help!!!! I have really enjoyed the thread but....
Please someone who knows, tell me how to clean the carbon off my saito 300 twin and seat the valves without ruining the thin chrome plating.....
Come on guys, I know how to make a decent 29lb Fw190, but engines I know little about..
Thanks--------- Alex
Please someone who knows, tell me how to clean the carbon off my saito 300 twin and seat the valves without ruining the thin chrome plating.....
Come on guys, I know how to make a decent 29lb Fw190, but engines I know little about..
Thanks--------- Alex
03-09-2008, 04:13 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
ORIGINAL: mike early
Unlike car engines, Saitos do not have an oil pump and reservoirs.
Unlike your car engine, Saitos are designed with more ring gap than needed....for 1 reason: To allow oil into the bottom engine. How? Blow-by by design. The blowby in your car engine is an undesired effect. If you could avoid it completely you most certainly would.
How much pressure do you think is needed to blow all these seals you keep mentioning?
How much pressure do you think is created by blowby?
How much pressure do you think is created with a nipple on the exhaust?
ORIGINAL: linkadrip
Well i have been an Automitive mechanic for over 20 years and When to Spartrtan Aeronautical School and have worked on lycomings and other aircraft engine's. this is a 4 stroke engine Just like a car or in a cessna. I don't see it operating any differnet. and if you connect the muffle up to that crankcase and put pressure into That crankcase you are going to blow the seals out in it period. (wanna bet?)
If the crankcase pressures were greater then the muffler pressure then i could see it working. You can connect a manifold pressure guage to that nipple when it is runnning and it still flucuates just alot faster basically . connect the same pressure gauge to the muffler and see the difference the muffler pressure is way higher then that crankcase.
The smog system on cars reburns the Crankcase blowbuy vapors through a valve called the PCV Valve witch is connected to the intake manifold. the PCV Valve has a check ball in it that ratttles back and forth basically a check valve. that gets carboned up from time to time and has to be cleaned periodiacly with carb cleaner when the valve stops rattling.
The older cars like my 57 thunderbird that has a 312 in it Has a Down draft tube that comes out of the crankcase and goes straight out and down toward the ground. Watch a tractor pull sometime. and you will see the crankcase venting happening under the engine From the the draft tube looks like steam coming out on the engine. Older cars just vented there crankcase vapor to the open air ther was no smog.
Only point i'm trying to make is i would hate to see someone take there perfectly good Saito that is working perfectly fine and hook the muffler up and blow the seals and gaskets out of it possably damage the engine. just to get rid of the little bit of excess waste oil coming out of the engine. So the plane gets a little oilly. Get an OS if you dont like the excess oil the new one reburn the crankcase vapors form what i have heard.
I dont like them i think there Ugly Engines may run good and be less messy but there Ugly I'll put up with the little oily mess but that my Personal prefrence others may vary.
The key thing is if it aint broke then why go and try and fix it.
Sigman
Well the name linkadrip was made up along time ago. I used to play alot of MMORPG games. Friends and i would sit around and make up names to use in the games. Linkadrip was just one that was thought up and seems unique.
ORIGINAL: mike early
You make too many assumptions here and ignore events occuring when the engine is running vs turning it over by hand.
ORIGINAL: linkadrip
i connected a pressure Gauge to the Crankcase nipple on my .72 GK Saito engine today, was curious about it and it does fluctuate. sucks and blows. turning it over buy hand the needle would go to negative pressure vaccum and then to Positive pressure. So connecting it to the muffler i would think is a bad idea. The muffler would be pressurizing the crank case and may blow seals out in the engine.
Now if you want a PCV Valve like on a car and your inventive and want to burn that excess oil you would Connect it to the intake manifold just like a car. That is what the pcv Valve in car is for reburning the crancase blowbuy vapors. But it would have to have a check valve just like a car. Look up PCV Valve for more information on this. the new OS 4 stroke Engines reburn the crancase vapors from what i have heard, havent read up on it.
Best thing to do is just vent it to a tank with a vent on the tank if you want to catch all the excess oil. or just vent it to the outside of the plane and after flying wipe the plane off like i do. Keeps my front wheel on my trainer nice and lubricated.
But connecting it the the muffler would be asking for trouble dont do it.
i connected a pressure Gauge to the Crankcase nipple on my .72 GK Saito engine today, was curious about it and it does fluctuate. sucks and blows. turning it over buy hand the needle would go to negative pressure vaccum and then to Positive pressure. So connecting it to the muffler i would think is a bad idea. The muffler would be pressurizing the crank case and may blow seals out in the engine.
Now if you want a PCV Valve like on a car and your inventive and want to burn that excess oil you would Connect it to the intake manifold just like a car. That is what the pcv Valve in car is for reburning the crancase blowbuy vapors. But it would have to have a check valve just like a car. Look up PCV Valve for more information on this. the new OS 4 stroke Engines reburn the crancase vapors from what i have heard, havent read up on it.
Best thing to do is just vent it to a tank with a vent on the tank if you want to catch all the excess oil. or just vent it to the outside of the plane and after flying wipe the plane off like i do. Keeps my front wheel on my trainer nice and lubricated.
But connecting it the the muffler would be asking for trouble dont do it.
You make too many assumptions here and ignore events occuring when the engine is running vs turning it over by hand.
If the crankcase pressures were greater then the muffler pressure then i could see it working. You can connect a manifold pressure guage to that nipple when it is runnning and it still flucuates just alot faster basically . connect the same pressure gauge to the muffler and see the difference the muffler pressure is way higher then that crankcase.
The smog system on cars reburns the Crankcase blowbuy vapors through a valve called the PCV Valve witch is connected to the intake manifold. the PCV Valve has a check ball in it that ratttles back and forth basically a check valve. that gets carboned up from time to time and has to be cleaned periodiacly with carb cleaner when the valve stops rattling.
The older cars like my 57 thunderbird that has a 312 in it Has a Down draft tube that comes out of the crankcase and goes straight out and down toward the ground. Watch a tractor pull sometime. and you will see the crankcase venting happening under the engine From the the draft tube looks like steam coming out on the engine. Older cars just vented there crankcase vapor to the open air ther was no smog.
Only point i'm trying to make is i would hate to see someone take there perfectly good Saito that is working perfectly fine and hook the muffler up and blow the seals and gaskets out of it possably damage the engine. just to get rid of the little bit of excess waste oil coming out of the engine. So the plane gets a little oilly. Get an OS if you dont like the excess oil the new one reburn the crankcase vapors form what i have heard.
I dont like them i think there Ugly Engines may run good and be less messy but there Ugly I'll put up with the little oily mess but that my Personal prefrence others may vary.
The key thing is if it aint broke then why go and try and fix it.
Sigman
.(how did you come up with the name linkadrip?) just curious.
Unlike car engines, Saitos do not have an oil pump and reservoirs.
Unlike your car engine, Saitos are designed with more ring gap than needed....for 1 reason: To allow oil into the bottom engine. How? Blow-by by design. The blowby in your car engine is an undesired effect. If you could avoid it completely you most certainly would.
How much pressure do you think is needed to blow all these seals you keep mentioning?
How much pressure do you think is created by blowby?
How much pressure do you think is created with a nipple on the exhaust?
The worst thing about the internet is someone preaching gospel and is quite incorrect.
and then someone reading it, believing it, and then preaching it themselves.
Why does it have to be this way?
and then someone reading it, believing it, and then preaching it themselves.
Why does it have to be this way?
But i'm not preaching Gospel i really dont care. And wont be commenting on this subject anymore. I realize that these little engines dont burn the oil and maybe i'm wrong. But like hobbsy said as well as others Don't break it if it ain't broke.
For some reason your against this So Hook up the muffler and find out.
Thats what i did with my Twsit 40 everyone told me not to put an OS61 FX engine in it then everyone told me not to put a macs tuned pipe on it so i did it. And it turned out to be the fastest plane i own and performes awesome. I buy Know means know it all that's for sure.
I have no idea what pressure it takes to blow them seals out. and not going to try and find out.
Dont care how much pressure is Created buy blowby.
Pressure on the Muffler is for pumping fuel to the engine buy pressurizing the fuel tank and thats all it needs to do IMO.
It just seems logical if you wanted to reuse the crankcase oil you would have it go into the intake to be reused. but i would think that your engine will run very poorly and will most likely just spit more oil out the muffler still making a mess.
I probably shouldnt have said anything.
Ta Ta everyone good luck with your Saito's
03-09-2008, 04:16 PM
RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Put a little tooth paste on the valve seat and spin the valve against its seat. Do this only enough to clean the carbon off.
Normally the valve seat on a Saito is self cleaning and you do not need to clean the seat.
Be careful because the seat in the head is only chrome plated aluminum.
Normally the valve seat on a Saito is self cleaning and you do not need to clean the seat.
Be careful because the seat in the head is only chrome plated aluminum.
03-09-2008, 05:04 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
I was just checking Bill Robison's Saito notes. His very second entry in his sticky in the Glow Engine site mentions using a large pencil erasor to clean the carbon off the valves and seats. Might want to take a look at his commets. Just a suggestion.
03-09-2008, 05:27 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
I keep a 2nd 12V battery with me. When I need the extra power, I have a special 'jumper' made up that allows me to hook the two 12V batteries in parallel. That usually starts my 120 (granted, my two 12V batteries are only 7AH). I only haul out that 2nd battery if I need it.
Just putting in my $.02
Bob
Just putting in my $.02
Bob
03-09-2008, 08:32 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
I might try that. I have 2 field boxes, each with a 7ah battery. I talked with a friend today and he said that he carries a portable battery pack that is used to jump start cars. He uses this to start his big Saito's. Thanks for the suggestions!!
Mike
Mike
03-09-2008, 09:10 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
No problem, Mike. Glad if you can use it. And I've seen other guys use a battery pack like you describe and that works pretty good too!
Bob
Bob
03-10-2008, 09:42 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
ORIGINAL: RPMcK
Lighten up Mike. Opinions are what a discussion forum is all about. Like the TV---- if what we see upsets us too bad we could always turn it off.
Lighten up Mike. Opinions are what a discussion forum is all about. Like the TV---- if what we see upsets us too bad we could always turn it off.
Yes, but who shall protect the masses?
03-10-2008, 10:03 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
ORIGINAL: mike early
Yes, but who shall protect the masses?
ORIGINAL: RPMcK
Lighten up Mike. Opinions are what a discussion forum is all about. Like the TV---- if what we see upsets us too bad we could always turn it off.
Lighten up Mike. Opinions are what a discussion forum is all about. Like the TV---- if what we see upsets us too bad we could always turn it off.
Yes, but who shall protect the masses?
03-10-2008, 10:13 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
ORIGINAL: mike early
Yes, but who shall protect the masses?
ORIGINAL: RPMcK
Lighten up Mike. Opinions are what a discussion forum is all about. Like the TV---- if what we see upsets us too bad we could always turn it off.
Lighten up Mike. Opinions are what a discussion forum is all about. Like the TV---- if what we see upsets us too bad we could always turn it off.
Yes, but who shall protect the masses?
Guess I really do need to be protected from myself. Can't even seem to send a message correctly sometimes. Enjoy your mission Mike.
03-10-2008, 01:15 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
I finally finalized my Saito 1.00 installation in a Senior TeleMaster, I tested the 1.00 with a MasterAirscrew K 14x8 and a Graupner 14x7, it turned them at an identical rpm of 9,400 on 10% WildCat. I will opt for the Graupner since its better looking. I have a TurboHeader and Jims 90 degree adapter with an extension on the TH that runs right down through the right engine mount forward of the mounting screws. The black paint survived several 3 or 4 minute runs at full throttle Now for a good day to fly it.
03-10-2008, 05:00 PM
RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Dave,
The installation looks great. I should have had the adapter anodized black for you. I'll try to remember it the next trip to the coating shop.
Jim
The installation looks great. I should have had the adapter anodized black for you. I'll try to remember it the next trip to the coating shop.
Jim
03-10-2008, 05:23 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
I went to Batteries plus today and bought a better battery. it is a 12ah battery to replace my Hobbico 7 ah and it turns over my 180 with no problem. Costs $42.00 , but I think it was worth it. It is slightly heavier and not much bigger. Fits in my field box with room to spare. It even came with a full 2 year free replacement warranty. I even tried it with my cheap Hobbico 90 starter(not using it) and it works. Thanks for all the replies!!!!
Mike
Mike
03-10-2008, 08:04 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Hey guys, I'm a first time Saito owner, just got a 125 to put in my Cessna 182. I can't wait to hear what it sounds like. I got it so I can have extra torque when flying in the mountains. What size prop should I break it in with? And what size three blade will work well?
03-10-2008, 09:21 PM
03-10-2008, 09:34 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
XT, I have been running WildCat Premium Extra 5%, 10% and 15% in mine for 16 years and have yet to lose a bearing. I tried some of the green engine killer but it left my engines dry inside. I didn't like that. I think a little castor is the key to a long life on an engine.
03-10-2008, 10:47 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
All of my Saitos, even a used one, had manuals with them. If you bought it from a LHS, he might have taken it to the john to brush up on specs and just forgot to put it back in the box.
You can download a manual at Horizon Hobby, or I'll send you one.
You can download a manual at Horizon Hobby, or I'll send you one.