Welcome to Club SAITO !
09-13-2008, 07:02 PM
RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
ORIGINAL: beaver180
Sure.. how about a 22x4 3 blader???
Got a APC 12x6 on a similar sized 4 stroke and it does all I need, maybe a low pitched 13" would do you better
Off to fly me 105.5" Citabria with my re tuned ( thanks w8ye and hobbsy ) Saito 180, which turns a MAS Classic 18x6 prop real good. Just hope it'll better 32oz in ten minutes.
CFN, Paul
Sure.. how about a 22x4 3 blader???
Got a APC 12x6 on a similar sized 4 stroke and it does all I need, maybe a low pitched 13" would do you better
Off to fly me 105.5" Citabria with my re tuned ( thanks w8ye and hobbsy ) Saito 180, which turns a MAS Classic 18x6 prop real good. Just hope it'll better 32oz in ten minutes.
CFN, Paul
Cheers
peter
09-13-2008, 07:11 PM
RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Yes i have a new apc 13x6 for running in and initial flight testing.Would like to try the 14x6 and maybe a 15x4.Thanks for the info and conformation.Now all i need to find is a citabria big enough for a 22x4 three blader,oh,and an engine to swing it..
09-13-2008, 07:43 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Hello: can anyone tell me if the slobber tube coming from the crankcase pressure can be hooked into the exhaust line to get rid of excess crank pressure without slobbering all over the bottom of the fuse?
both the saito and enyas i have have the slobber tube from the crankcase. this would be a nice way to get rid of extra oil without coating the fuse.
thanks
Big-Mo
both the saito and enyas i have have the slobber tube from the crankcase. this would be a nice way to get rid of extra oil without coating the fuse.
thanks
Big-Mo
09-13-2008, 09:41 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
big-mo- i dont know if the crank vent line can be routed into the exhaust or not but unless the exhaust in routed far from the fuse there will still be mess. i always route the vent tube down the landing gear if its possible. almost no mess to clean up afterwards.
09-13-2008, 10:14 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Dear Hobbsy
Thanking you for your imediate reponse.Having good knowledge of engins
sometimes does not help. I have tried everthing even what you have adviced
and yet could not solve the problem. Now would like to finally send it for repairs to
Saito service centre. I tried saito service centre in England and there reponse is
very poor. thus am wanting imformation of reliable service centre in USA or Asia
thanking you omce again Udayan
Thanking you for your imediate reponse.Having good knowledge of engins
sometimes does not help. I have tried everthing even what you have adviced
and yet could not solve the problem. Now would like to finally send it for repairs to
Saito service centre. I tried saito service centre in England and there reponse is
very poor. thus am wanting imformation of reliable service centre in USA or Asia
thanking you omce again Udayan
09-14-2008, 06:52 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Big-Mo:
That tube to the tank from the muffler is intended to create back pressue to the fuel tank so that there is a constant pressure on the fuel supply to the engine to assist in creating a constant fuel flow. The vent tube from the crank is intended to allow the crank to vent excess oil that would otherwise build up in the crankcase. If you were to connect this tube to the muffler, you would create back pressure to the crank case which would not allow the excess oil to vent and this would probably damage your engine. I would not do this.
That tube to the tank from the muffler is intended to create back pressue to the fuel tank so that there is a constant pressure on the fuel supply to the engine to assist in creating a constant fuel flow. The vent tube from the crank is intended to allow the crank to vent excess oil that would otherwise build up in the crankcase. If you were to connect this tube to the muffler, you would create back pressure to the crank case which would not allow the excess oil to vent and this would probably damage your engine. I would not do this.
09-14-2008, 06:54 AM
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09-14-2008, 11:24 AM
RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
To further clarify the slobber line from the crankcase. If you connect your pressure tap from the muffler to the slobber line you will be pressurizing it. The purpose of the slobber line is to release blow-by gasses from the crankcase, created when the piston allows pressure to get by it during the power cycle. Any presurization of this line defeats its purpose. That tap and line gives the unburned lube oil a place to go since our 4-stroke Saitos (and a lot of others) do not have a dedicated sump as in automobile engines. As a matter of fact, auto engines have a form of slobber line and it is called a positive crankcase ventilation line. The EPA has not allowed this to vent to atmosphere since the 60's and hence is returned to the induction system to be re-burned. Remember the old crankcase vents? Nothing but a hogs hair cap on the crankcase vent line.
If you place a crimp on a straight exhaust pipe, this is a form of back pressure. This helps with pressurizing the tap for the fuel tank. On your car you may have a restrictive exhaust system which will also create back pressure. Did you ever hear 'glass pack mufflers on a by-gone hot rod? You can hear the result of back pressure when the individual takes his foot off the accelerator. The exhaust note pops as it decelerates.
The pressure tap on the muffler is just that, a pressure line. It allows you to plumb a line to the fuel tank to keep a slight pressure on the fluid in the tank for even-running with a set high speed needle. With a pressure line to the tank, I find very little reason to fiddle with the high speed needle here in Florida. I see some guys in my club forever toying with needle settings on their aircraft. They are the ones with the most engine problems and I just shake my head.
Bob
If you place a crimp on a straight exhaust pipe, this is a form of back pressure. This helps with pressurizing the tap for the fuel tank. On your car you may have a restrictive exhaust system which will also create back pressure. Did you ever hear 'glass pack mufflers on a by-gone hot rod? You can hear the result of back pressure when the individual takes his foot off the accelerator. The exhaust note pops as it decelerates.
The pressure tap on the muffler is just that, a pressure line. It allows you to plumb a line to the fuel tank to keep a slight pressure on the fluid in the tank for even-running with a set high speed needle. With a pressure line to the tank, I find very little reason to fiddle with the high speed needle here in Florida. I see some guys in my club forever toying with needle settings on their aircraft. They are the ones with the most engine problems and I just shake my head.
Bob
09-14-2008, 01:45 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
ORIGINAL: retransit
To further clarify the slobber line from the crankcase. If you connect your pressure tap from the muffler to the slobber line you will be pressurizing it. The purpose of the slobber line is to release blow-by gasses from the crankcase, created when the piston allows pressure to get by it during the power cycle. Any presurization of this line defeats its purpose. That tap and line gives the unburned lube oil a place to go since our 4-stroke Saitos (and a lot of others) do not have a dedicated sump as in automobile engines. As a matter of fact, auto engines have a form of slobber line and it is called a positive crankcase ventilation line. The EPA has not allowed this to vent to atmosphere since the 60's and hence is returned to the induction system to be re-burned. Remember the old crankcase vents? Nothing but a hogs hair cap on the crankcase vent line.
If you place a crimp on a straight exhaust pipe, this is a form of back pressure. This helps with pressurizing the tap for the fuel tank. On your car you may have a restrictive exhaust system which will also create back pressure. Did you ever hear 'glass pack mufflers on a by-gone hot rod? You can hear the result of back pressure when the individual takes his foot off the accelerator. The exhaust note pops as it decelerates.
The pressure tap on the muffler is just that, a pressure line. It allows you to plumb a line to the fuel tank to keep a slight pressure on the fluid in the tank for even-running with a set high speed needle. With a pressure line to the tank, I find very little reason to fiddle with the high speed needle here in Florida. I see some guys in my club forever toying with needle settings on their aircraft. They are the ones with the most engine problems and I just shake my head.
Bob
To further clarify the slobber line from the crankcase. If you connect your pressure tap from the muffler to the slobber line you will be pressurizing it. The purpose of the slobber line is to release blow-by gasses from the crankcase, created when the piston allows pressure to get by it during the power cycle. Any presurization of this line defeats its purpose. That tap and line gives the unburned lube oil a place to go since our 4-stroke Saitos (and a lot of others) do not have a dedicated sump as in automobile engines. As a matter of fact, auto engines have a form of slobber line and it is called a positive crankcase ventilation line. The EPA has not allowed this to vent to atmosphere since the 60's and hence is returned to the induction system to be re-burned. Remember the old crankcase vents? Nothing but a hogs hair cap on the crankcase vent line.
If you place a crimp on a straight exhaust pipe, this is a form of back pressure. This helps with pressurizing the tap for the fuel tank. On your car you may have a restrictive exhaust system which will also create back pressure. Did you ever hear 'glass pack mufflers on a by-gone hot rod? You can hear the result of back pressure when the individual takes his foot off the accelerator. The exhaust note pops as it decelerates.
The pressure tap on the muffler is just that, a pressure line. It allows you to plumb a line to the fuel tank to keep a slight pressure on the fluid in the tank for even-running with a set high speed needle. With a pressure line to the tank, I find very little reason to fiddle with the high speed needle here in Florida. I see some guys in my club forever toying with needle settings on their aircraft. They are the ones with the most engine problems and I just shake my head.
Bob
RCV and OS engines have suggested running the breather lines as long as you like....or even to the muffler if desired. My buddy has an RCV and was worried because the manual states 2-3" max tubing on the breather. I told him to send an email to RCV and find out what the consequences are for longer breather line. The email reply stated that longer lines are not a problem and they plumb their own planes with the breather going to the muffler. I told my friend to send another email asking why they are scaring everyone with their 2-3" recommendations in their manual.....not sure if he did, though...
Here is the actual email from RCV:
"Thank you for your query. There will be no problem in you using 6 inches of tubing. If you are looking to expel the waste from the breather outside the cowl, another option is to tap another nipple into the exhaust muffler and connect the tubing to this.
Hope this helps"
Here is the OS manual:
I am sure Saitos cannot be that much different
I have plumbed mine this way and cannot see any difference in performance. I do see a lot cleaner airplane.
09-14-2008, 05:01 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
What size tank do they recommend to be used with the 325 radial? What type of flight time is anyone getting with that respective tank? Thanks!
09-14-2008, 07:35 PM
RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
I don't know what the pressure is at the muffler tap or the crankcase tap. If the plumbing is set up as in the O.S. version or as RCV says, then the pressure must be greater at the case than at the muffler.
The only thing that would bother me is when the muffler pressure AND the crankcase residue is introduced to the fuel tank there might be some issues with contaminents entering the tank. A filter may resolve that problem.
Bob
The only thing that would bother me is when the muffler pressure AND the crankcase residue is introduced to the fuel tank there might be some issues with contaminents entering the tank. A filter may resolve that problem.
Bob
09-14-2008, 08:08 PM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Like a said a very touchy subject.
Just do what you want with it and let it be. Ive never heard anyone say they blew theirs up yet and a couple months back we debated this very exact issue and a couple months before that and a couple months before that [&:]
Just do what you want with it and let it be. Ive never heard anyone say they blew theirs up yet and a couple months back we debated this very exact issue and a couple months before that and a couple months before that [&:]
09-14-2008, 09:16 PM
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09-15-2008, 12:17 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
RPMcK,
Did you ever find the info on the velocity stack that you were looking for?
Below is a link that might help. I found a velocity stack for the 125 (same for 100) at Horizon Hobby. I'm surprised [sm=omg_smile.gif]that the product support would tell you a velocity stack would restrict air flow, it improves air flow. Hot rod people have been using v...stacks for years to improve engine performance.
Here is the link: http://www.espritmodel.com/index.asp...OD&ProdID=5736
Just wonder were did you get a 115? It isn't listed on the Satio web site. Is it an old model?
Good Luck,
Shubova
[8D]
Did you ever find the info on the velocity stack that you were looking for?
Below is a link that might help. I found a velocity stack for the 125 (same for 100) at Horizon Hobby. I'm surprised [sm=omg_smile.gif]that the product support would tell you a velocity stack would restrict air flow, it improves air flow. Hot rod people have been using v...stacks for years to improve engine performance.
Here is the link: http://www.espritmodel.com/index.asp...OD&ProdID=5736
Just wonder were did you get a 115? It isn't listed on the Satio web site. Is it an old model?
Good Luck,
Shubova
[8D]
09-15-2008, 06:05 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
Like your test bed there hobbsy, can you show me how you've hooked up your throttle??
With the Golden knights..... does fuel and gunk stick more readily or not to the black??? Is it harder to clean off them??? I imagine harsh solvents would remove the paint too.
Cheers, Paul
Oh and now get longer than 15mins on my tank, a good third at least left after a flight........ love this engine!! Infact I think I'm slightly under prop'd with the 18x6 MAS Classic
With the Golden knights..... does fuel and gunk stick more readily or not to the black??? Is it harder to clean off them??? I imagine harsh solvents would remove the paint too.
Cheers, Paul
Oh and now get longer than 15mins on my tank, a good third at least left after a flight........ love this engine!!
Infact I think I'm slightly under prop'd with the 18x6 MAS Classic
09-15-2008, 06:34 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
The test stand is a PSP, the throttle is very flexible in that it can be loosened up and pivoted around and swiveled where ever you need it to line it up.
09-15-2008, 06:35 AM
RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
hobbsy you've got hairy knuckles
Time for me to eat some seriously big slices of humble pie.Don't know how i did it but mixed my fuels up and poured the wrong juice into my aeroplane refuelling container,about four litres worth and have been running that stuff thru my 62a,man they can take some abuse.The fuel was for my two stroke race car,5% synthetic 40% nitro,my bad bad bad[&o]If anyone read the prop figures i gave for the 62 a while back please disregard them.I'm tempted to throw my tacho in the bin too.
Time for me to eat some seriously big slices of humble pie.Don't know how i did it but mixed my fuels up and poured the wrong juice into my aeroplane refuelling container,about four litres worth and have been running that stuff thru my 62a,man they can take some abuse.The fuel was for my two stroke race car,5% synthetic 40% nitro,my bad bad bad[&o]If anyone read the prop figures i gave for the 62 a while back please disregard them.I'm tempted to throw my tacho in the bin too.
09-15-2008, 06:42 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXNGV2&P=SM
This one or a Graupner 14x7 3 blade from Hobby Lobby GP314070 14x7, 3 Blade Prop
This one or a Graupner 14x7 3 blade from Hobby Lobby GP314070 14x7, 3 Blade Prop
09-15-2008, 06:45 AM
09-15-2008, 07:22 AM
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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO !
on my 125, I get the best RPM range with the MAS 14x7 3-blade prop. The MAS 15x7 and the Graupner 14x7 seem to bog a bit.
The velocity stack will straighten out the airflow and might even allow more air to enter the engine....but not if the stack is a bottle neck. The larger engines' carbs are larger than the stack.
The velocity stack will straighten out the airflow and might even allow more air to enter the engine....but not if the stack is a bottle neck. The larger engines' carbs are larger than the stack.