Kmot

My Feedback: (24)

Bill, is that G60 in your collection?

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Thunderchild:

Absolutely no guarantee of how correct this is, but I was told in the mid 70s Saito contracted to supply engines for a target drone, and the G60F was the result. Saito supplied all the bits, assembly was done before launch.
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loughbd:

Maybe you know some more?
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TomK:

No, it's not mine. It was on eBay a couple years ago, I copped the pictures but the bidding got too rich for my blood. Or higher than I was willing to pay anyhow.

Bill.

Thunderchild

And again Bill.........

Do you know the size of the drone it was fitted to - or (shiver of anticipation) have a photo of it perchance?

Thunderchild

loughbd

Actually about 100 of them were imported by Paul Bender of Hobby Shack. Hobby Shack was the importer of Saito in the mid to late 70's to the middle 80's. I worked for Hobby Shack then. They were also made as a Marine engine with a water cooled head. Not made as a target drone engine. Water cooling just wouldn't work for that purpose. I have both versions. Got them from Terry Toops who made the remakes of the Edco Sky Devil ignition engine. Saito also made some very nice (and expensive) steam engines that were sold through Hobby Shack. I got my first Saitos while I was in Japan. The 30 open rocker and three 80 twins. Also the first 45's with the bolt on heads. try and find those today. I'm using one in an old Pilot Sky Loop 404.

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

loughbd:

Thanks for coming in on this. All I know is what the eBay seller told me.
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TC:

Nope. No pictures. See above.

Bill.

loughbd

Bill,

I had 4 of them at one time. Ran one of the aircooled ones just to see how it worked. Awesome engine. Quite powerful. As good as many modern 60 glow engines. I sold one of each when I saw the prices they were getting on ebay. I got $400 for the airplane and $525 for the marine. I suspect quite a few were sold in Japan. They weren't big sellers at Hobby Shack. They were expensive for a 60 and not real practical in a pattern plane. The Japanese were big on anything new or different. I got my OS FT120 Twin there in 1980. Paid $240 for it at the local hobby shop. I paid $125 for the Saito FA80T twins. I came home with a whole lot of toys.

Kmot

My Feedback: (24)

I remember all the cool stuff from Hobby Shack. I started shopping with them when they were in a little brick side store in Fountain Valley. I worked for them part time in 1978 and helped stock and open the Encino store. The manager had been lured away from Indy R/C. He went back after a year, didn't like California living I guess.

Back to Saito: I remember seeing the big Saito steam ships and tug kits on the shelves. The Saito steam engines and boilers were in the glass cases. Along with the G60 engines, air and marine. I used to drool over all that stuff and long for it soooooo bad. But the cost was way prohibitive to a guy with a small hobby budget. Still is, in essence. Seen how much those large Saito boats and engines go for today? $3 to $5 grand for the whole package.

loughbd

Bill,

You may be thinking of the K&B drones used by the Army. Goldberg made foam drones that looked like a Mig 27. Each box came with two planes, a K&B 61 and later the K&B 65 Sportster and one R&S radio. The original drones were big foam Deltas that used the K&B 61. I got to watch them being flown at Ft Lewis, Washington by an Air Force friend of mine. Excitement???? You should see a coulpe dozen soldiers trying to shoot one down with small arms. Occasionally one would get holed. But... when they used the 20MM gatling gun, the plane lost every time. I have pictures of a K&B 61 that suffered a direct hit from a 20mm round. It will never work again. I'll try and dig out that picture. We had a real good arrangement. The Army bought K&B 100 fuel and authorized the Airforce guys to sell it to get the other stuff they needed to fly. ie starter, props, batteries, etc. I got the fuel for 4 bucks a gallon.

Sigh, oh for the good old days. There was a write up about these targets in RCM about 15 years ago. They were called RCMATS (Radio Controlled Military Aircraft Target) or something like that.

loughbd

Kmot,

You should see Hobby Shack now. It's Hobby People and they have 22 stores in Ca and Nevada. Unfortunately they have become pretty much a bunch of toy stores. I was at the opening of the San Diego store, the El Cajon store, the Lawndale store and the Lakewood store. I quit smoking the day the El Cajon store opened and Sally Bender gave me an OS FT240 Twin. That was July 22, 1989.The standard joke at H Shack was I only took my pay in engines.


AMA 13797

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

loughbd:

I remember those "Mig27s" too. A year or so back a bunch of them hit the market, one fellow had 70-80 of them. Sold for $75 including the Sportster engine. Radio included? I don't know.

Think he ended up just about giving them away. There were several threads here on RCU about them.

Bill.

Fred Dings II

My Feedback: (2)

Hi, y'all.
I came over from the U-Can-Do .60 forum where I heard about a "Club Saito"

I have a 1.5 that has two flights on it, a 100 that hasn't been in a plane except for break in, and a 72 GK that has about 60 flights on it in a Twist.

The 72 really hauls my Twist around.

I have been buying O.S. and YS engines for 30 years until I started buying kits from Horizon who were suggesting Saito engines.

I put the 1.5 in a Cap 232 and the 72 in my Twist and I bought the 100 for a U-Can-Do .46 as some of the guys were saying how great it performed.

Here is a story for you: two of us bought a Saito 100. I bought the plain jane and Earl, the other pilot, bought the 100 GK.
We went to the field to break the engines in together on a test stand. I balanced my prop, he said he didn't. My engine vibrated so badly that before I could get a tank of fuel through it, the carb broke off the back plate. Earl's engine ran fine. Same setup, same fuel. I called Horizon, and sent the engine back and they replaced it by return mail. This time I put the engine on my plane. Again, it vibrated so badly that I was afraid it would wreck the throttle servo. Sent it back to Horizon, and they replaced the rear bearing and I have a letter from the tech stating that he ran it and now has no vibration. It is for sale. I have had so much trouble with this engine I don't even want to take it out of the box.
I realize mine is an isolated case, as I have heard so many good things about the Saito line. However, I want a divorce.

Send me an e-mail if you have any interest in either of my 3 Saito engines.

loughbd

No radios Bill, They were on a military use only frequency. Uncle Sam frowns heavily on civilian use of his frequencies. I spent 27 years in the Navy learning his quirks..

The govenment surplus of those things must have been in the Zillions. The old 61 was ten times the engine the 65 was. 65 was a modern slag engine.

Barfly

Guys, how is the main needle sealed against fuel leakage? I can't see an 'O' ring in there, or anything else. Simply close tolerance, maybe?

Cheers from the Barfly.

Kmot

My Feedback: (24)

What's a slag engine?

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

Barfly:

The needle seal is an o-ring inside the threaded part of the spray bar. Look closely at this picture, it's the black ring just inside.

Bill.

Lidman

My Feedback: (41)

Ok Bill I want to get into the Saito Club my collection is a 45, 72,two 82a's two 91's and two 100fa's does this qualifiy me for the club? Please let me know. Thanks Mike Goff (Lidman)

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

MikeG:

We'd let you in even if you had only one Saito, and that a steam or two stroke engine.

Haw.

Bill.

PS: Lidman is number 211. wr.

loughbd

Kmot,

Just after the war (WWII that is) everyone and their brother came out with model airplane engines and some of them were truly junk. Sort of like the original Thunder Tigers from the 70's. Some of the real crummy ones like the Bullet and Thor had an aluminum piston running in an aluminum sleeve. Standard joke was that if you ever got one started you just wore it out. They were called slag engines. The K&B Sportsters had a chromed piston running in an aluminum cylinder and the crankshaft ran in the aluminum crankcase with no bronze bushing or ball bearing. Even had a rubber O-ring for a head gasket. Hence the name, modern slag engine. Weren't really lousy but not up to K&B's past quality.


AMA13797

evansh

Barfly
Hobby Shack in Fook Hai building South Bridge Road Singapore sell SAito and stock spares
I have found them very helpfull and can get parts fairly quick
Not at home at moment but can dig out tel number at weekend if you wish.
They are on web and list spares in stock.

Barfly

Shucks Bill, I feel silly for not seeing that. I think I need to change it on both my engines, the needle just falls through. Thanks for the pic.

Cheers from the Barfly.

Barfly

Thanks evansh, I'm very familiar with Hobby Shack, been there many times. I'll shoot off an order as soon as get my ducks in a row. I'll be in Sg. in a couple weeks, maybe can pick up in person.

Cheers from the Barfly.

Kmot

My Feedback: (24)

Thanks for the info loughbd.

Fred Dings II

My Feedback: (2)

loughbd

Interesting description of a slag engine in that the new YS 63S engine also has no liner according to the info on the Central Hobbies web site. My initial reaction was disblief, but it's true.

Kindly comment on this for me. It appears from the posts that you and Will Robinson among others, are very knowledgable.

Regards, FRED

William Robison

My Feedback: (3)

loughbd:

I have to come to the defense of Kading & Brodbeck here, particularly in the case of the Sportsters 65 engines.

They, like the Caterpillar V636 diesel and the OS FL-70, were built to a price.And I think Johnny Brodbeck did it better than the other two mentioned.

Yes, the piston ran in an alloy bore, but it was hardened, as was the crank bearing. So long as castor oil was used, and the rpm not run through the roof, the engine did very well. It was a "Lugger," trying to make it go fast would lead to its demise. And the later (and current) ones have a bronze insert bearing cast in for the crank.

Keep the rpm down, use at least a castor blend oil, put it in a sport plane, it will give a long and useful life.
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Fred Dings, II:

YS isn't the only one with an alloy bore. But they are not plain aluminum, they have a surface treatment to make them wear better. Some have said YS uses "Nilasil" treatment, others say it's something else. Norvel's "Revlite" for example, is an anodized surface, it wears very well. And Mercedes-Benz, for many years ran the pistons directly against an aluminum, bore with a high silicon (NOT siliconE) content in the alloy. When I last overhauled my 500SE I put standard size rings back in it, no measurable wear.

Ringed (or chromed) pistons in an alloy bore? It can be done, and done very well.

Bill.

Fred Dings II

My Feedback: (2)

Hello, Will

Thank you for the excellent explanation. I was hoping that YS wasn't reducing its manufacturing costs to the detriment of the engine. That's what happened at RCA where I used to work before it was sold to GE, who sold it to Thomson, who has now sold it to an India company.

Regards, FRED